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Author Previous Topic: Sliding door reefers? Topic Next Topic: New source for 3D printed arch-bar trucks
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OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  12:09:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Scott!

I very glad you find some use in my ongoing blathering. I tend to overwhelm/overload thread followers with all my postings when I'm pumped about a concept/project/etc. Oh well: I is what I is.

Box oil headlamps:

We're fortunate in HO that we have several options for box oil headlamps. Plastic or brass. I will select among those options. (I have some plastic ones on hand, and will be ordering some brass versions, too.)

All:

Roster Thoughts...

So it's becoming a bit clearer to me how to do my MDC w/NS wheels 2-8-0's I have on hand:

* The 3 late model versions with hollow boilers will become Baldwin 2-8-0's and retain their straight boilers. (i.e. resemble the 1881 Frisco 2-6-0 posted above.) Though die cast metal, I'm hoping they will be easier to work with than the plastic w/cast-in weight MDC boilers of yore. (Or so I hope.) These 3 straight boiler 2-8-0's will be the "latest and greatest" purchased by the C&P. (I haven't gotten far enough along with the roster to devise numbers as yet.)

* The 3 earlier 2-8-0's with NS wheels and plastic w/cast-in weight boilers, will get Mantua boilers such as is being explored of late. These will represent engines purchased in the late 1870s (or just prior to the 1881 purchased 2-8-0's.) I don't think these stepped boilers need to be Baldwins, but perhaps need to be Rogers? What other builders used such boilers? Input?

* Still need to figure out where the 2-6-0's will fit in among all this.

* The 4-4-0's are simple: They're the first engines the C&P purchased and worked fine during construction when out on the flatter portions of the C&P. That is, until the C&P ran headlong into the Conejos Brazos Mountains... then they needed bigger hammers. (So along comes the 2-6-0's and the first 2-8-0's.)

Next I'll need to figure out how many engines for a line with a 250+ mainline (plus some branches) with the majority of said line in the ridiculously rugged Cojones Brazos Mountains. I'll use the CM about three years after its start-up as my measuring stick.

Havin' fun!

Later gators!

Andre



Edited by - OK Hogger on 03/13/2021 12:12:26 PM

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OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  12:55:34 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dave H:

While out in the Ozarks layout building a few minutes ago, your "2-8-0 into a low driver 4-6-0" idea had me holding up some 2-8-0 frames and checking some of the 4-wheel pony trucks I have on hand for fitment. Looks like the best fit (visually and physically) would be the hinge mounted 4-wheel truck assembly from an AHM/Pocher 4-4-0. (Flanges will need turned if the stock wheels are retained.) I think that truck w/hinge assembly can be made to fit with minimal modification.

Seems to me the only real question marks would be:

* How the deep inset drivers will track.

* How the long overhang out front would impact performance on curves. (Think: When shoving in helper service.)

* How to get more weight over the drivers.

To me, those are the real "hmmm" issues with the idea. It is tempting to mock one up and see what would happen. Perhaps later.

As for precedent: I think the CM had some lower-driver 4-6-0's? (Likely not 51" as would the MDC version.) However, a 51" driver 4-6-0 for mountainous service would certainly not be out of the realm of reality?

VERY interesting idea 'ya had there, Dave!

Andre



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OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  3:19:41 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Lands me, the fun just keeps on happenin'!

Going through my stash, I re-discovered an old project I had waaay back before my journey to the 19th century had begun. This is a model that started life when I was first into steam and was aiming at the late teens/early 20s. I'm talking mid-1980 time frame, here. I was still in my early 30's!

Anyway...

What you're looking at: A modified MDC step-gear 0-6-0 frame upon which I offset the rear axle a bit, hacked off the bulky step pilot and mated a tube pilot to the front. (Haven't a clue what pilot that is.) It was set up for a Sagami 16x30 and has NWSL gears in it. The result was going to be a shorter 2-6-0. At the time I was going for a Gorre & Daphetid 2-6-0 #25 "look".

Well, now that I've landed solidly in the 19th century (1880s in particular) for nigh 3 decades, this is project can still be usable with a change of domes, and eventually a long pilot in keeping with my early 1880s era. I think it can have the look of an 1870s Baldwin product, what do you think?






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railman28
Fireman



Posted - 03/13/2021 :  3:55:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think it's working. Yes, the smokebox is too long. My mind is telling me that the last driver is about a foot too back, but the eyes says it's good.

It's only make-believe

Country: USA | Posts: 5817 Go to Top of Page

OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  4:00:02 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Look what I found! Some artist attempted to depict the Colorado & Pacific!

Pretty close... but the artist missed it by not having a link bar on the pilot and few other anachronisms. Also, none of the small group of C&P historians have turned up a record of what colors the first engines arrived in, either. Not a bad depiction of a gentler portion of the Cojones Brazos Mountains, though. Still, in spite of its shortcomings, this painting is better than nothing!






Edited by - OK Hogger on 03/13/2021 4:03:05 PM

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OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  6:13:00 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Bob!

I didn't see your post earlier.

The 2-6-0:

I like it... needs some things "adjusted/fixed"... but this concept also has promise, me thinks.

As for the rear driver:

Could be. At this early stage, the cab can be slid back if'n that's what ends up needing to happen.

I was sort of going for the look of this D&RG 2-6-0 as modeled by International Models Inc:



Except mine may predate the build date for the model's prototype by a year or two. Of course, mine will be modeled to represent an earlier period than the IMI model represents.

Supper's callin'! All fer now!

Andre



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OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  8:12:22 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bob:

So 'ya got me puzzlin' 'bout that rear driver. (Me puzzlin' over somethin' is seldom a good thing! )

Decided to throw some parts together so I could have an MDC 2-6-0 with stock spacing to set beside my cobble job.

Here's what I saw:





More puzzlin': Seemed like I could convince myself it was too far back... no... I think it's almost dead-on with the stock one... no I think it's too far back...

Then I had this plum brainy idee! I set them on end! Here's what I learned:





Appears to me the rear driver is might nigh spot-on between the two. Not a whit's difference that I can readily see.

So, seein' as I have accepted the stock MDC spacing for decades, I think I'm okay with my Frankenstein Jr. 2-6-0 I've hatched up.




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railman28
Fireman



Posted - 03/13/2021 :  10:29:13 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, I missed. Frankenstein used a consolidated frame with a new axle slot and the one on the left is the mogul frame.

Bob


It's only make-believe

Country: USA | Posts: 5817 Go to Top of Page

OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  10:52:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Bob!

Still a bit of a miss: The Frankenstein is a modified MDC step-gear 0-6-0 frame.

My Roster...

I'm cautiously getting excited about my roster prospects. I think I'm going end up with some engines that are unique (yet plausible) to my theme but look good to my eyes. Main thing is that I will need to leave lots of holes in the paper roster to allow for future interests/projects and such.

Andre




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OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/13/2021 :  11:24:33 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
My Mantua boiler onto MDC 2-8-0:

I'm liking the way its shaping up. I anticipate at least 3-4 of the modified Mantua boiler 2-8-0's.

I'm struggling, though, as to what builder could have built such an engine. The Mantua boiler is sold as a "Rogers" boiler. However, the Mantua model (which includes its boiler) is oversized for HO. Thus, my consol is a bit on the chunky side.

SO... what locomotive company could produce such an engine in the late 1870s? Here's my (ahem) train of thought on this, but I'm hoping you all can share input and help me out here.

ROGERS:

I could stay with it being a Rogers. Perhaps my consol could be one of the largest 2-8-0's Rogers made to date (late 1870s), and Rogers designed them specifically for the C&P? If I go this route, do I need to use the Rogers domes that Cal-Scale offers? (Below) Or, would fluted (as above) be typical?





GRANT:

Sometime ago I found this pic:



For 1879, that's a burly Consolidated locomotive. It also has a stepped boiler. Not as pronounced as on the Mantua boiler, but still, it's stepped. Grant seemed to like to use tall domes, but I think some of PSC's domes could be "close enough".

Again, could it be that Grant special designed a 2-8-0 for the C&P and my model is what they came up with?



Thus far, the above two builders are all I've come up with as potential suppliers of the 2-8-0's the C&P purchased in the late 1870s.

ANY input concerning my thought rationale, OR, any expertise you can share about other prototype builders would be much appreciated.

Andre



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railman28
Fireman



Posted - 03/13/2021 :  11:50:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, Rodgers and Grant would build them that big.

Bob


It's only make-believe

Country: USA | Posts: 5817 Go to Top of Page

OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/14/2021 :  07:27:24 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
That's good to know, Bob. At least I know that I can go either Rogers or Grant. That's two!

Then there was also Cooke, Brooks, Dickson, Pittsburg... but I know less about them than I do Rogers or Grant! (Which ain't much.)

Perhaps I need to post a pic of my 2-8-0 concoction to the "Modeling Pre-1895" FB group and see what those more learned than I have to say?

EDIT: Then again, if I post a pic and my question to a large group like FB, then there will be more modelers watching eBay for Mantua/Tyco boilers (I still need a few)... and I have essentially screwed myself again. Scratch that idea!

Andre



Edited by - OK Hogger on 03/14/2021 07:29:49 AM

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Michael Hohn
Fireman



Posted - 03/14/2021 :  11:39:18 AM  Show Profile  Visit Michael Hohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Andre,

I think your 2-8-0 conversions will be the most successful for capturing the look of a beefy western locomotive. Having done one of these conversions based on early to mid 1990's articles in Rail Model Journal or Model Railroading, the proportions look good even though the size of the boiler suggests 1890's more than the 1870s. Typical boilers were 4' diameter in the 1870's and into the 80's, whereas the Mantua boiler is 5' diameter. (I'm talking about the straight part, not the wagon-top part.)

If I knew 25 years ago what I know now I might have considered modeling in OO scale, which is closer to the scale of the Mantua locomotives. Of course the track gauge would be off by about 1/2 foot, but there are always compromises. Since I scratchbuild most of my rolling stock and structures I would just have to get an OO scale rule. But I didn't do that and won't be anytime soon (probably never).

Consolidations in the 1870's and 80's generally sported wagon-top boilers, the PRR being one exception. They were handsome locomotives.

Mike


_________________________________________________
Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced. James Baldwin

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OK Hogger
Fireman

Posted - 03/14/2021 :  4:45:29 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Mike!

Yes, when it comes to TOC19 engines, my "druthers" have to capitulate to the "givens". That is, what I'd like to have is tempered by the reality of what is available to work with. I absolutely am not going to scratch build anything if I can keep from it. For sure not locomotive boilers and such. I will work with what's available and it will just have to be "good 'enuf".

In that vein, what I'm coming up with for power that's somewhat unique, will help me so the bulk of my roster won't have an all-MDC look to it. That will pretty much have to be "good 'enuf" for me.


FWIW:

Fighting a funky MDC 51" driver 2-6-0 mechanism this afternoon. It's one of the kits w/NS wheels. However, there's so much slop in the axle slot the geared driver visibly clicks fore/aft as it turns. Add to that the step gear is not concentric, so that doesn't help. I have some NWSL step gear sets... but given the slop in the axle slot, I'm not so sure that will help enough.

Spit Polished...

I read in my "Little Engines & Big Men" that during the era when engines were assigned to Engineers, the vast majority of Engineer's took great pride in their steeds and keep them polished and clean. This means "so long!" to the run down, decrepit look that so many love to model when it comes to steam. Along that line, I experimented with making aged brass (literally) shine like a new penny.

Here's a steam dome I worked over alongside an untouched sand dome...





Here's a closer look at the bell I polished beside a naturally aged one...





I think this has promise, too!

Andre



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CNE1899
Engine Wiper

Supporting Member


Posted - 03/14/2021 :  4:50:36 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Andre,

Shine on, shine on! Looks pretty.

Scott



Edited by - CNE1899 on 03/15/2021 07:00:18 AM

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