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2-6-6-2 Undecorated Manuta Steamer.

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  • 2-6-6-2 Undecorated Manuta Steamer.

    Received my Manuta 2-6-6-2 Undecorated tank engine today.

    Mark's post about his Manuta 2-6-6-2 piqued my interest. I've always wanted one of these to compliment my roster of Shays for a lumber portion of my eventual layout. I searched E-bay for on and came across this undecorated one.



    Being used I have no idea if the previous owner did any kind of adjustment on it. It's plain DC power. A quick run on my test track showed it ran OK. Slow speed wasn't bad. Did notice some of the side rods have a slight bow inward. Possibly from picking the engine up. I did notice it was rather light for it's size. I'll post further information as I go through the engine. I will be adding pick-up wipers on all wheels for a 12 wheel pick up.

    More as I get into the engine.

    Bernd
    New York, Vermont & Northern Rwy. - Route of the Black Diamonds

  • #2
    Bernd,

    I have 4 of these, DCC ready types, 3 have been converted to ON30 and one is still in the box. Adding a quality decoder makes them run very good. I didn't add any weight to mine, and they still run very good. You are right about the valve gears, miss handling will bend them wrong. I run mine a lot, they need that.

    Les

    Comment


    • #3
      Good for you Bernd! In the right hands, and the right temperament, you CAN make a silk purse of a sow's ear out of one of these.

      I'm following your upgrade with pleasure. Please make this your next adventure.

      Sorry for the lousy picture, but here is one way of adding pickups to it. And I'm sure you can fabricate an even better method.




      Louis L&R Western Railroad
      Pacific Northwest Logging in the East Coast

      Comment


      • #4
        quote:


        Originally posted by visman48


        Bernd,

        I have 4 of these, DCC ready types, 3 have been converted to ON30 and one is still in the box. Adding a quality decoder makes them run very good. I didn't add any weight to mine, and they still run very good. You are right about the valve gears, miss handling will bend them wrong. I run mine a lot, they need that.

        Les


        Hi Les. I'm not going to add DCC. I might go with R/C. I have a couple of engines with it installed, using 6 volt motors. They run very smooth. They are steamers from IHC, 2-6-0 Moguls. Once I get into taking this engine, 2-6-6-2, apart I'll see about adding more weight. I was looking at the tanks and think there might be room for some lead shot.

        Bernd
        New York, Vermont & Northern Rwy. - Route of the Black Diamonds

        Comment


        • #5
          quote:


          Originally posted by desertdrover


          Good for you Bernd! In the right hands, and the right temperament, you CAN make a silk purse of a sow's ear out of one of these.

          I'm following your upgrade with pleasure. Please make this your next adventure.

          Sorry for the lousy picture, but here is one way of adding pickups to it. And I'm sure you can fabricate an even better method.




          Hi Louis,

          Picture is worth 1000 words even if it is blurry. [:-magnify] I'm thinking of adding the wipers on the bottom like I did for Bill Gill's 0-4-0. Was also thinking of converting it to an oil burner by enclosing the coal bunker and adding a tank car tender to carry extra fuel. That'll give me 8 more wheel pick-ups. Also contemplating a motor up grade with pulley reduction for a much slower running engine. But first the wipers. The "dreamy" stuff can be contemplated afterwards.

          This will be my next adventure along with some TT scale projects.

          Bernd
          New York, Vermont & Northern Rwy. - Route of the Black Diamonds

          Comment


          • #6
            Quick up date.

            I disassembled the engine last night. First thing I didn't like was the fact that you need to cut the wires to the lights and motor to get it apart. Once that was done I was able to inspect the drive system better.

            I believe I can safely say that the valve gear, at least on this engine is the most sloppiest I've ever seen. I can't believe the engine ran as smooth as it did without any of the valve gear getting hung up. I believe this could have been the problem with Mark's (aka NP2626) first engine and could be the fault of his second engine. Definitely a quality control issue here.

            So the immediate action with this engine will be adding extra wheel wipers and looking at installing LED's for lights that will have plugs for easier disconnection when disassembly is needed on the engine.

            After that I'll delve into the linkage slop and what can be done to fix it along with the sideways slop in the drivers. I think if these items get tighten up it give a good running engine.

            Bernd
            New York, Vermont & Northern Rwy. - Route of the Black Diamonds

            Comment


            • #7
              I'm following your work, Bern. I have a couple of tender versions I picked up at swap meets for a song that I'd like to add DCC to. I guess my first task will be adding wheel wipers. I'm interested in seeing how you handle the valve gear problem.

              Mine run OK on DC, except the pilot truck sometimes picks switches, so I removed the spring and added a lead weight to the truck.

              George
              The sky is not my limit, it's my playground.

              Comment


              • #8
                Bernd, I enjoy seeing you spin gold from straw. I'll be watching this one.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'll watch with interest, too. I have one of the tender versions in GN Green with sound. I already know the sound will eventually be upgraded at some time.
                  Karl Scribner-Curmudgeon

                  Cedar Swamp
                  SW of Manistique, MI

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I have disassembled the engine into pieces parts. All pictures are of the front engine. The rear engine is the same.

                    These all I took apart. I’ve cut the wires to the lights and motor.



                    I’ve labeled some of the problem areas with arrows and letters. Note at “A” the distance from the wheel to the frame. The rear axle is pushed all the way to the right. Quite a gap from wheel to frame versus the front wheel. At “B” it almost looks like they didn’t use the correct screw to hold the rods in place. At “C” it almost looks like the pin is falling out. At “D” you can see the slop fit. Also notice the outer rod is slightly bent. This could have been the previous owner. Remember I got the engine off of E-bay.



                    The wheels are all pushed to the left. Again look at the rod linkage. Not very straight.



                    The red circle shows interference between the crank pin piston rod. The pin should be shorter.



                    Note the slop and wide clearances of “A” & “B”



                    With the axle pushed all the way to the right the crank pin hits the right piston rod.



                    The front engine flipped up right as it would when sitting on the tracks. With the axle pushed all the way to the left there is lots of clearance between crank pin and piston rod.



                    Not so on the left. Also not out of shape eccentric rod at bottom left. (green circle)



                    Note how bent the hanger for the monkey motion valve gear is. Also the crank pins seem way to long.



                    Ever wonder why your engine may have a hitch in it’s git along? This could be why (green circles)



                    So as you inspect closely each picture I’m sure you can find more problems. This could be the reason why when you return the first engine and get a replacement it may have the same problems. How many of you have the same scenario with the side rods? I’m sure this is not peculiar to just this engine I have. Over all the engine looks very good and runs pretty good considering the valve gear. This is going to take some long and dedicated work to straighten out. But first I’m going to work on installing wheel wipers and upgrading the lights and wiring with plugs. That will be the next installment. Be patient as this will not happen till next week. I have some non-modeling projects that are more important to do first.

                    Bernd
                    New York, Vermont & Northern Rwy. - Route of the Black Diamonds

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      That is one start of a detailed shopping list of defects, right out of the gate. Just think of when you start to take a longer better look, what you might find as well. These model steam locomotive manufactures need you in their quality control division.

                      After seeing this list, I'm going to have to look over the ones I've got a bit better and see what's up. Thanks for taking on this project. I like these locomotives very much, and any help to keep them better runners is a big help. They make having a larger locomotive on a home layout with tighter curves something to treasure. (WHEN THEY RUN RIGHT!


                      Louis L&R Western Railroad
                      Pacific Northwest Logging in the East Coast

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        quote:


                        Originally posted by desertdrover


                        That is one start of a detailed shopping list of defects, right out of the gate. Just think of when you start to take a longer better look, what you might find as well. These model steam locomotive manufactures need you in their quality control division.



                        I did spend some time in quality control at work. Plus some of the jobs I had at work called for precision work. I guess it stuck with me.

                        quote:


                        After seeing this list, I'm going to have to look over the ones I've got a bit better and see what's up. Thanks for taking on this project. I like these locomotives very much, and any help to keep them better runners is a big help. They make having a larger locomotive on a home layout with tighter curves something to treasure. (WHEN THEY RUN RIGHT!



                        Makes me wonder if the models leave the factory in this state. So if there is anybody else that owns one of these whether tank engine or with tender, chime in and let the manufacture know what's going on. Perhaps they know. Not going there.

                        Louis, your welcome. I find a challenge like this fun. I'm hoping I can see it through to the end. I think it's going to be a long term project for sure. First will be the pick-ups and plugs. The linkage might not happen till this fall when the weather gets colder. Have many house projects that need finishing up this year, plus I'm involved in developing some TT scale products for sale. As I said I'll start next week on the wheel pick-ups.

                        Bernd
                        New York, Vermont & Northern Rwy. - Route of the Black Diamonds

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Bernd, What an examination. That is a very intensive first diagnostic

                          look. I have made a list of each item that needs to be checked on my steamers.

                          Louis is correct as usual. Your needed in quality control'. I can't wait to see this loco

                          when it comes out of the Kingstone ~ Re-Conditioning Locomotive Works facility'...[^]


                          Ted

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            This engine comes across as a tutorial for 'Hitch in its git-along', sub-category 'side-rods & valve gear'. The only topics left to address are 'bad driver quartering' and 'side rods don't match frame'. So this is shaping up as a good lesson for anyone with a brass or die-cast loco that isn't living up to its potential.
                            James

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              quote:


                              Originally posted by quartergauger48


                              Bernd, What an examination. That is a very intensive first diagnostic

                              look. I have made a list of each item that needs to be checked on my steamers.

                              Louis is correct as usual. Your needed in quality control'. I can't wait to see this loco

                              when it comes out of the Kingstone ~ Re-Conditioning Locomotive Works facility'...[^]


                              Hi Ted. Long time no communicate.

                              I don't think I'd want a job in quality control. I'd be applying the "Golden Shovel" award to the brainless heads of people who won't straighten out. [:-bigeyes2] [:-censored]

                              Hey, you never know what The Kingstone Locomotive Works will take on as a project. The staff better up to doing a good job or the "Golden Shovel" will be applied to their head. [xx(] [:-irked]

                              Bernd
                              New York, Vermont & Northern Rwy. - Route of the Black Diamonds

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