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 A few 2-6-0 Mogul questions (Backdating, Radii...)
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Yannis
Section Hand

Posted - 11/24/2020 :  07:27:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello everyone,

As I am considering some additions to the On30 collection, i got my sights on the classical Bachmann Mogul. I got three main questions, concerning backdating, radii and versions.

1. Backdating: From what I have read, i can replace the cab, possibly the domes, remove electric equipment and replace front light with a lamp. Am I missing something for 1870's? I read that the Colorado Central for example had Moguls from the 1870s, so i guess the Mogul is not a bad choice for the era I got in mind (vs lets say a 4-4-0 inside frame).

2. Radii: I have seen a lot of info on this, but i want to double check if things will work (visually) at 15.75" radius. To put things into perspective, the Porter I have and the Bachmann coach, look ok on 35-36cm radii (like 15" and below...). Competition here is again the 4-4-0 inside frame and how that would look on 15.75" radius curves.

3. Versions: I see the DC and DCC versions, and I think the latter has metal gears on the drivetrain and pickup on both the Loco and the Tender. Is that about it? Does it make sense to pay +$120 for the DCC version vs the DC? FYI, I plan to install a loksound (or Zimo) sound decoder and I have some experience from doing hardwire installs and mods like custom speaker cabs, led installs, MTC21 sockets etc... (to Diesels though...). So does it make sense to go for one version vs the other? I care about running qualities (and here the metal gears sound intriguing). I don't mind the hardwiring, but I would not like to spend too much timing milling frames etc...

Many thanks in advance for your time and replies.
Yannis

Country: Greece | Posts: 79

BigLars
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 11/24/2020 :  11:02:52 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The 2-6-0 will do a 15" radius curve but it is rather large. I would replace the smoke stack as well. DCC conversion is easy, DCC with sound is harder as you have to run the wires back to the non powered tender. I would spend a little extra and buy the DCC version and use the conversion time to do something else.


Country: USA | Posts: 11893 Go to Top of Page

Yannis
Section Hand

Posted - 11/24/2020 :  11:36:45 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Lars many thanks for the reply! To put things comparatively, does it look worse than the 4-4-0 inside frame? Or the Bachmann 36' coach?


Country: Greece | Posts: 79 Go to Top of Page

BigLars
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 11/24/2020 :  1:39:04 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The inside frame is a much smaller engine and would be more typical of a theme park ride more of a 2 foot gauge engine. In my opinion the mogul is a larger 3 foot engine typical of western narrow gauge. Here is a picture of the inside frame with a Bachmann passenger car. I will take a side by side of the two locomotives later.



Country: USA | Posts: 11893 Go to Top of Page

BigLars
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 11/24/2020 :  2:11:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote







Edited by - BigLars on 11/24/2020 2:12:13 PM

Country: USA | Posts: 11893 Go to Top of Page

Yannis
Section Hand

Posted - 11/24/2020 :  2:20:52 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Lars many many thanks!!!! Those photos are really helpful and difficult to come by! Much appreciated help.

You got me thinking now... on which one would fit the purpose on my layout. I guess the 4-4-0 would look better around 15.75" radii yet I read that the Mogul can take tighter radii with more ease?

So a 2-6-0 might be more appropriate for the SW old-west type layout?



Country: Greece | Posts: 79 Go to Top of Page

BigLars
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 11/24/2020 :  2:37:44 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I will let someone else try to answer the appropriate question. I mostly use Porters on my Arizona Mine layout.


Country: USA | Posts: 11893 Go to Top of Page

brucet
Engine Wiper

Posted - 11/24/2020 :  5:04:53 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I've got one short section of 15" curve. About 7-8". The Mogul will do it, but, but it doesn't like it. You need a short something coupled behind it and not a coach. In fact the only loco I have that isn't happy on the 15" section is my shay. If the pistons are on the inside of the curve the Shay will jack rabbit.



Country: Australia | Posts: 498 Go to Top of Page

Yannis
Section Hand

Posted - 11/25/2020 :  01:55:14 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Lars and Bruce many thanks for the replies and much appreciated info! I am trying not to get something that will "overwhelm" the layout/turns.
From what you describe, it seems that the Mogul might be overwhelming, and the photos that Lars posted are VERY informative with respect to the size/volume differences (I could not ask for better photos Lars!), which apart from Radii is also helpful in scene composition.

Lars, many thanks for mentioning that you use Porters... as this brings me to another idea that I had in the back burner as plan B if Moguls and 4-4-0's are too much for the layout. The Plan B is to go for another Porter, and simply enhance the long-range capabilities using an auxiliary tender, like the project that Verne did some years back, adding a keep-alive in the tender (so like two birds with one stone).

Maybe a Porter with a tender (0-4-2 Porter) is a better fit for the mixed (or Passenger) train and 15.75" radii...



Edited by - Yannis on 11/25/2020 01:56:51 AM

Country: Greece | Posts: 79 Go to Top of Page

BigLars
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 11/25/2020 :  08:51:01 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
IF you are adding keep alive to the porter please do not use Verne's instructions for soldering the wired to the decoder. Use Reg Barron's instructions, I have successfully used Reg's instructions on close to 40 Porters. I have many of Verne's Porters and the keep a lives were wired incorrectly and I had to fix them. Backwoods Miniatures also made 0-6-0 porters with larger water tanks.


Country: USA | Posts: 11893 Go to Top of Page

BigLars
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 11/25/2020 :  08:59:06 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here are three porters I did for customers. I hope they inspire you.












Country: USA | Posts: 11893 Go to Top of Page

Yannis
Section Hand

Posted - 11/25/2020 :  11:08:03 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Super inspiring work Lars!!!!! Much appreciated inspirational photos.
I ll try to find and look into the conversion that you mentioned by Reg Barron. Verne's work was very inspiring with respect to using the passenger trucks modified.

I ve been meaning to ask Lars. On adding a tender to a 0-4-2 Porter that already has a coal bin. Does it make any sense for the tender to have both water and coal? Or is it more sensible to make the tender all water and then extend the coal bin (taller) as you did?



Edited by - Yannis on 11/25/2020 11:45:47 AM

Country: Greece | Posts: 79 Go to Top of Page

Reg Barron
Engine Wiper

Posted - 11/25/2020 :  3:39:25 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
If you were to use Verneís instructions for wiring the tender only, you might be ok, since the Porter would then have 8 wheel pickup. The keep alive wiring I used, for the sound equipped porters came directly from Soundtraxx, so it was correct. The big issue is that it requires soldering a wire to a very tiny component in the middle of the circuit board. Today, you can purchase Tsunami IIs that are very tiny and also are ready made to accept KAs (which are also smaller today).

Reg Barron



Country: USA | Posts: 219 Go to Top of Page

Yannis
Section Hand

Posted - 11/26/2020 :  10:11:23 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Reg, many thanks for the reply and info.

I was referring to mostly the aesthetics and not the wiring when mentioning Verne's work, as I plan to remove all factory circuitry and hardwire new.
Unless of-course, the onboard circuit-lightboard is having an 8-pin socket or something. Sorry if i did not make this clear.

Speaking of aesthetics and realism, I take it that leaving the coal bin as is in the 0-4-2 and adding a tender with coal, makes no sense right?



Edited by - Yannis on 11/26/2020 10:12:11 AM

Country: Greece | Posts: 79 Go to Top of Page

Michael Hohn
Fireman



Posted - 11/26/2020 :  10:29:00 AM  Show Profile  Visit Michael Hohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I think itís more likely an auxiliary tender would be for water.


Country: USA | Posts: 7000 Go to Top of Page

BigLars
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 11/26/2020 :  10:30:06 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
If you look at #9 I extended the fuel bunker to hide the keep alive and only added a water tank. Finding water in the desert would be the obstacle. The thing about ON30 is it is mostly made up as we go so there is no right or wrong answer.


Country: USA | Posts: 11893 Go to Top of Page
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