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Author Previous Topic: Trouble with signage Topic Next Topic: Enginehouse for Horace and William Creek
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George D
Moderator

Premium Member


Posted - 09/27/2016 :  08:01:00 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Nice detail work on the roof, Robert.

George



Country: USA | Posts: 13735 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 09/27/2016 :  10:17:17 AM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Michael Hohn

Robert,

Great job on the roofs. To my eye they are appropriately precise. Must be a relief to see them fit so well.

Mike




Thanks, Mike, and yes, you are right, I was relieved that things fit together rather well. That said, there are adjustments to be made, custom fitting if you will. Despite the accurate measurements of my plans . . . just can’t quite get the thousands of an inch precision I’d like, at this scale


Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 09/27/2016 :  10:21:16 AM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hey Bill, George,

Thanks for taking a look at my build! And thanks for your kind words, much appreciated!


Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 10/15/2016 :  12:02:32 AM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
There is a short roof above the Coal Shed that extends out from the bottom of the Tower.

I could be wrong, but I suspect it was covering part of the lift mechanism.
These photos show the size and make-up of that roof. Again, I used layout paper (four sheets glued together to create a card stock) and glued it down onto some balsa wood.

Back to the shingle surface; I then glued down one trimmed strip to serve as a shingle along its length. You can see the line of that shingle in the second and third photo.

Subtle is what I wanted and what I go. After all, the prototype shingles (may have been tar paper . . . don’t know, maybe someone reading this does?) were not thick, perhaps a 1/8 of an inch or less . . . tough to match that in HO scale.

Then I painted it.



Clear view of the Shingle split . . .



After constructing it, I dropped the completed assembly into place, checking for fit.


Like a glove!



Once I glue the tower onto the Coal Bin, and then to the Coal Shed roof, it may need a slight adjusting.
. . . not ready for that quite yet.

Next:
The Coal Bin roof; using the same formula, 4 sheets of layout paper to form a thin card stock; I measured and cut out the shape you see below . . . then, drew out the shingle widths in pencil.

I took my hints as to size and placement of each shingle from photographs of the prototype. After that I cut out strips (one sheet thick) and glued them down so that there was a slight overlap from bottom to top.



The gabled part of the roof line, was a separate piece, taped on at the back. The join will get a cap, or top shingle later, just like the tower and shed roof received.



Before I painted this piece, I decided to prepare the 12 cement footings under the Coal Bin . . .

In the picture below you can compare the raw 3D printed piece to the smoothed/filed/primed and painted one



Once again I used oil paint. French Ultra Marine Blue/Titanium White/Naples Yellow/Ivory Black . . .



In the photo below you can see a tiny gap above the left and middle beams where they are to be attached to the cement footings . . . that means the beam to the right needs trimming.

Adjustments, adjustments, always adjustments




NEXT: Coal Bin . . .

Added, or rather cut notches into the side vertical beams so as to fit the horizontal ones into place, as per the prototype.





Once more another quick “fitting” set-up; the cement foundation supports (all 12 have been sanded and painted and ready to go!) the Bin roof and horizontal beams . . .

I will paint the shingled roof after I am sure about the overhang measurements, or profile, of the eaves.

That means constantly looking at photos of the prototype and guess-timating



NEXT: Painting the Coal Bin Roof
Painted the back at least the overhang; I could see that there was a sag in the paper so it needs some kind of support inside . . .




So I picked up some balsa wood . . . a little less than an 1/8 of an inch thick, measured and cut it out . . . but had to make some adjustments for the center beam between the two gables.

So I cut it up into two pieces.





Note to self: don’t use carpenters glue on layout paper . . . it causes ripples.

Even so, this little fix-up did the trick with that sag I was talking about.

Along each strip you can see residue glue speckles. So I used a Gum eraser . . . with little success . . . eventually I used my knife to scrape some of it off.





A light painting of the roof and you now can readily see the shingle parts.

In the pictures below you can see the warping along the edges . . . that is something I hope to eliminate with the roof trim (made of wood) and perhaps some more wood supports underneath. This time however, I will glue that wood down with crazy glue.






So . . . last entry in this days post.

Another loose fitting . . .



More to come.



Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page

Ensign
Fireman

Posted - 10/15/2016 :  08:29:34 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Rob, your work is looking really fantastic!!

Greg Shinnie



Country: Canada | Posts: 6914 Go to Top of Page

Michael Hohn
Fireman



Posted - 10/15/2016 :  08:39:45 AM  Show Profile  Visit Michael Hohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Robert,

Beautiful work . . . As always.

I have a few questions, and forgive me if you explained earlier.

You use several sheets of layout paper in place of card stock. Why is that?

The concrete footings turned out very nice and I like the color you used. Why did you use oil paints? Just something you had on hand? Prefer them over acrylics?

Looking at the photos of your structure, I can see it's pretty chunky. I like its overall lines, especially with the ramp/trestle and covered shed combined with the large bin. Interesting prototype.

Mike


_______________________________________________________________________________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me, as I go walking that freedom highway -- Woody Guthrie

Country: USA | Posts: 2340 Go to Top of Page

railman28
Fireman



Posted - 10/15/2016 :  11:33:55 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Excellent Robert! It's a great looking model.

It's Only Make Believe

Bob Harris

Country: USA | Posts: 4174 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 10/15/2016 :  3:45:13 PM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Greg, Mike, Bob, Thanks guys!


Mike, good questions! Here are my answers:

1) (Q) You use several sheets of layout paper in place of card stock. Why is that?

(A) Layout paper is very thin, and by gluing a number of sheets together I can control the card stock thickness I want.

Working at the scale that I am, HO, there is a distinct modeling advantage in being able to customize the card thickness. Another advantage of using layout paper is that it takes oils almost as well as the finest portrait linen and that stuff is a dream to work with! The advantages the layout paper affords is that the oils will not ripple, shred or yellow it, and the oil dries Matt! That is desirable because it takes on the natural appearance of whatever one is modeling . . . wood, metal, concrete etc.

2) (Q) The concrete footings turned out very nice and I like the color you used. Why did you use oil paints? Just something you had on hand? Prefer them over acrylics?

(A) My career as an artist began as an illustrator, back in the 1970’s so I have been painting in oils for 40 + years. The advantages of oils over acrylic are as follows.

1) What you mix in oils is what you get . . . acrylics when wet are lighter than when dry, so you’re working with a moving target when it comes to mixing and matching colours in acrylic.

2) Because oils dry slowly you can cover the wood/paper/plastic/ in one colour and then dry brush in weathering streaks of another colour.

3) With oils you can work thick or thin, create texture with different colours or just by going thicker . . . throw in some graphite, or sand . . . sky’s the limit!


By the way, I use artist's oils out of a tube, and I thin them down with odder-less paint thinner. Other than the smell of linseed oil (which is actually quite pleasant) you don't have the (dangerous to your health) fumes and caustic stink, of turpentine . . . something like what we get with our hobby store oil colours. I have some of that stuff and on occasion use them (grudgingly).

Don't get me wrong though, the methods and materials I use for painting still require cautious handling and good ventilation!

There is another huge advantage, custom mixing your colour to reflect a prototypical look!

Oh and lest I forget, you can thin your oils down and use them in an air brush.

Hope this helps.





Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Edited by - Artman on 10/15/2016 5:30:45 PM

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page

DaVinci1953
Crew Chief

Posted - 10/15/2016 :  4:47:20 PM  Show Profile  Visit DaVinci1953's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Well....I've just finished reading this thread up to date. It's been many months since I've had time...due, as you know from too much personal stuff going on this year. I'm just thrilled that I can spare a day going to the Woodstock Train Show and get back into the swing of some modelling.
Are you going Bob? Greg and I will be there at opening time.
Seeing modelling such as you are doing on this thread is just what I need to get inspired again!

Lance


Lance Russwurm
http//www.lancerusswurm.com

Country: Canada | Posts: 682 Go to Top of Page

TRAINS1941
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 10/15/2016 :  5:04:30 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Just outstanding work Rob.

Is there any brand you use for the oils??


Jerry

"And in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." A. Lincoln

Country: USA | Posts: 9255 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 10/15/2016 :  6:03:47 PM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Lance, Jerry, thanks for taking a look at my build!

Lance, Wow, that’s one hell of a fine compliment coming from an amazing molder such as yourself!

Not to sound silly, but I am humbled . . . Thanks!

That Kitchener show is on a Sunday, November 6, right?

If so, I would like to go.

Jerry,
I use Winsor and Newton oils mostly, the Winton line. They call that line “student quality”, but don’t let that fool you . . . first off it’s more affordable then the “Artists/Profession” line, and second, in my opinion, just as good.

Truth be told, not all brands perform in the same way. I like Winsor and Newton’s thicker consistency . . . and thin it down as desired. Other brands, such as Rowney’s “Georgian” oils are creamier and I like them . . . cheap starter kits from China, not so much.

It’s not about where they come from that is my point, it’s about the ratio of pigment to oil that matters. It’s like they say, you get what you pay for, or better yet, know what you’re buying because we all know you can pay big bucks for something and still not get quality.

Too much oil and not enough pigment defines the cheap stuff, and it is hell to work with.

Hope this helps


Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page

Michael Hohn
Fireman



Posted - 10/15/2016 :  7:09:33 PM  Show Profile  Visit Michael Hohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Robert,

Thank you for the detailed reply. I have some oils bought many years ago for a project but have never found much use for them since. In fact I was considering just throwing them in the trash. Instead I am going to give them a try.

I actually don't mind the smell of turpentine but I think I will follow your lead and use the odorless variety.

The layout paper also sounds interesting. When you use multiple layers how do you glue them together?

Mike


_______________________________________________________________________________________________
Nobody living can ever stop me, as I go walking that freedom highway -- Woody Guthrie

Country: USA | Posts: 2340 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 10/15/2016 :  10:18:25 PM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Michael Hohn

Robert,

Thank you for the detailed reply. I have some oils bought many years ago for a project but have never found much use for them since. In fact I was considering just throwing them in the trash. Instead I am going to give them a try.

I actually don't mind the smell of turpentine but I think I will follow your lead and use the odorless variety.

The layout paper also sounds interesting. When you use multiple layers how do you glue them together?

Mike



Mike,
Depending upon how much card is needed, you can either glue together full sheets (torn out of the paper pad . . . 50 sheets per pad each sheet measuring 14 x 17 inches).

Their are other pad sizes, but that's the one I have.

It’s a little tricky getting a nice smooth application with full sheets, but with a little care and practice, it can be done.

However, if you only need something that measures 8 x 9 inches or even less, then use one of those sheets and slice out (X-acto cut) 4 pieces, roughly square, or rectangular to the size needed.

Always make it a bit larger than the exact cut needed.

I lay the parts down upon some cardboard or inexpensive paper, could be brown paper (I have a large roll of that), and then spray some of the 3M #77 adhesive glue onto the first sheet. Carefully lay down the next sheet over the freshly glued one.

I usually curve the paper up gently,holding the ends up and lightly touching it down into the center of the one with the glue on it.

Then you ease the sides down usually by just letting go of them.

You should have a nice even/flat application; meaning no bubbles or ripples. Lay some regular paper over that and rub down the fresh glued pieces so as to make a solid bond.

Like I said, it may take a bit of practice.

Repeat the same process for as many layers as you think you need.

Hope this helps.


Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 10/30/2016 :  12:05:35 AM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
The next steps show how I dealt with the six supports directly under the Coal Bin . . . getting things aligned properly was something I puzzled over for a few days . . . eventually I came up with this.

First I carefully measured the models under dimensions and drew out this template . . .




Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page

Artman
Engine Wiper



Posted - 10/30/2016 :  12:31:50 AM  Show Profile  Visit Artman's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Sorry about the short post, I hit the "Post New Reply" instead of the "Preview" button, before I was done.

So here it is . . .

After drawing up that template, I measured up and cut out this jig from card stock . . .



Here are the results . . . with a loose fitting to demonstrate where the two supports are to be attached.



Next came the NBW’s


The above image shows three support structures but there are only two. I just thought I'd show some different angles.


After that was achieved I then glued these supports to the Coal Bin and completed all cross-bracing . . . and the cement footings glued on as well.



Of course, I added the NBW’s on the Coal Bin as well . . . The close up cut-out of one NBW shows a metal plate I fashioned out of brass foil . . .



Brass foil:

This material is proving to be very useful; bought some of it at Wyndham Art Supplies.(Local art store near where I live)

The steps taken to score, then punch an impression of rivets or bolts, into the metal plate:


I used my sculpture tool, a pin or needle length awl to punch the rivet impressions. This was very simple to do because the foil is thin and soft yet imbued with just the right amount of rigidity that it can be coaxed into whatever position you desire. In my case, I wanted it to be flat after cutting it from the main sheet of brass (has a tendency to curl up when cutting). I flatten the foil with another sculpture tool that has a flat paddle end to it. Worked like a charm!


A quick check . . . and loose fitting Perfect results! Now they need to be primed and painted.



That it for now.


Robert Wanka
http://www.robertwanka.com

Edited by - Artman on 10/30/2016 12:39:37 AM

Country: Canada | Posts: 226 Go to Top of Page
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