Railroad Line Forums - Welcome- What are you using or thinking about
Railroad Line Forums
Username:
Password:
Save Password


Register
Forgot Password?
  Home   Forums   Events Calendar   Sponsors   Support the RRLine   Guestbook   FAQ     Register
Active Topics | Active Polls | Resources | Members | Online Users | Live Chat | Avatar Legend | Search | Statistics
Photo Album | File Lister | File Library
[ Active Members: 5 | Anonymous Members: 0 | Guests: 135 ]  [ Total: 140 ]  [ Newest Member: RyanAK ]
 All Forums
 Model Railroad Forums
 Dead Rail Forum
 Welcome- What are you using or thinking about
Previous Page | Next Page
 New Topic |   Reply to Topic | 
Author Topic Next Topic: An Experiment in Wireless Charging
Page: of 7

Bernd
Fireman



Posted - 08/10/2018 :  3:16:34 PM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi Dan,

Ya, one opinion, mine. I don't think your going to get a following here on that.

You have to consider the modeler who is recreating a specific time his railroad operated as far as controlling which track he takes. Usually decided by the dispatcher. If modelers are interested in an out the cab view, don't you think you'd hear or see more about this subject? I for one wouldn't be interested to own a system like that. One other thing would be the tech involved with the system. What if some component failed? I see modelers today have a hard time trouble shooting DCC, add to this what you are suggesting and the frustration level surely would rise.

I've seen the guys that fly quad-copters used the virtual goggles when they run through a race coarse. Pretty exciting.

Bernd


A PESSIMIST sees a dark tunnel
An OPTIMIST sees light at the end of the tunnel
A REALIST sees a freight train
The LOCOMOTIVE ENGINEER sees three idiots standing on the tracks

Country: USA | Posts: 2606 Go to Top of Page

DanT
New Hire

Posted - 08/12/2018 :  2:58:01 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Bernd,

Appreciate your thoughts. This is one of a few projects on the "back burner". But I will be installing a video camera to view and possibly record trips around a layout; already have most of the parts. YouTube has many videos showing tours of layouts, typically on club layouts. I personally find it enjoyable being able to do this.

Switch control involves using my existing Tx and DelTang Rx's. I just need to add IR leds plus an interface for switch control; working now with a manufacturer for that proper interface. The system would work in parallel with a typical operator control panel controlling typical switch machines, so that part not difficult technically. If I were to build a layout, the application would probably be limited to mainline tracks only. We'll see where all this goes later this year.

Dan



Country: | Posts: 37 Go to Top of Page

Bernd
Fireman



Posted - 08/12/2018 :  3:08:42 PM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I'll admit that I'm interested in seeing videos with on board camera's. They are fun to watch.

Your project sounds interesting and I'm curious enough to follow along.

I', also happy to give my opinion for what ever it's worth. For right now my frustration level has gone up a bit on the wireless charging. My other projects are lagging behind. I'm going to stick with adding a plug or removing the body on my experimental F7 project for now.

Keep us(? me)informed as you move forward with your projects. It's always good to hear from you.

Bernd


A PESSIMIST sees a dark tunnel
An OPTIMIST sees light at the end of the tunnel
A REALIST sees a freight train
The LOCOMOTIVE ENGINEER sees three idiots standing on the tracks

Country: USA | Posts: 2606 Go to Top of Page

DanT
New Hire

Posted - 08/13/2018 :  2:21:32 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I know about frustration. Although retired, model railroading is not my new full time job. One of my responsibilities is taking care of my 10 yr old granddaughter, whose dad passed away 5 yrs ago, while her mother works her full time job. With summer vacation, trains don't get too much attention. Not complaining, would never have it any other way, it's just the way it is.

I'm close to finishing up my charging tracks. The primary one will be a 2W system for 1S charging. The second charging track, which I may or may not build, will be a 1W arrangement since I already have the coils. The third will be a 3W system for the same reason and will hopefully work for 2S balance charging. The Wireless Power Consortium, IDT, TI, Wurth and TDK have been very helpful with coil selection and wireless charging technology. The big challenge is maximizing coil performance using the smallest footprint possible, then getting the minimum distance between coils for efficient energy transfer.

I'm really hoping this works. It could be a big plus for BPRC's credibility.

Dan






Country: | Posts: 37 Go to Top of Page

DanT
New Hire

Posted - 09/26/2018 :  11:18:58 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
This topic asks "What are you using or thinking about".

When I started getting serious about battery power and radio control, I had to decide what type of radio to buy. After watching this video, I went with an air craft type transmitter for maximum signal strength. Glad I did. Although the plane is not pertinent to this topic, the transmitter is. It shows how advanced r/c is and why it's so relatable to model railroading. I think you'll enjoy the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DQR5xrblVo

Dan



Country: | Posts: 37 Go to Top of Page

Bernd
Fireman



Posted - 09/27/2018 :  08:56:08 AM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DanT

This topic asks "What are you using or thinking about".

When I started getting serious about battery power and radio control, I had to decide what type of radio to buy. After watching this video, I went with an air craft type transmitter for maximum signal strength. Glad I did. Although the plane is not pertinent to this topic, the transmitter is. It shows how advanced r/c is and why it's so relatable to model railroading. I think you'll enjoy the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DQR5xrblVo

Dan



Perhaps that's why I took to R/C for train control. Back when Heathkit's were popular my Dad and I built up the radio's and servo's for flying model airplanes. Yup, I used to fly planes even though my hobby was model railroading. I can appreciate a good radio for reaching out to the plane. They can be flown out of radio range very fast, and I'm talking about a prop powered plane. Can't image how fast that jet was flying, 60mph?, 80mph?, 100mph? Image how fast that would get out of range.

As far as using an air craft radio to control trains? I tried one only it was for cars. I wrote about it on Freerails. I purchased a Flysky FS-GT2E system. The ESC (electronic speed control) was very limited in controlling the speed. It seemed to be either full forward or full stop. Same in reverse. I gave up on trying to use the system. I wish Dave of Deltang would still sell through his website. Even though the On30Guy sells Deltangs, the variety of Dave's product is not there. I do love the compactness of the Deltang system. Wish there were other vendors or products in this arena.

Bernd


A PESSIMIST sees a dark tunnel
An OPTIMIST sees light at the end of the tunnel
A REALIST sees a freight train
The LOCOMOTIVE ENGINEER sees three idiots standing on the tracks

Country: USA | Posts: 2606 Go to Top of Page

DanT
New Hire

Posted - 09/27/2018 :  11:43:50 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

I also started with an aircraft transmitter, a Spektrum DX5e. I used it on a large layout, part of which ran into another room, behind a brick wall. Despite that, and lots of wiring and tunnels, it worked great, never experiencing loss of signal or control. I still use it today, especially at big shows, where interference can be a problem. DelTang obviously knew all this before it went with this technology. I'm guessing hobby r/c will become more mainstream, with BlueTooth adding credibility, and we won't be needing to power our rails within a few years.

I had the same speed range problem using ESC's for cars. I didn't know at the time using 4 AAA batteries (4.8V), to keep the voltage on my DelTang Rx below 6V, was not enough voltage for the ESC, rated at 9.6V. Maybe this was happening with you.

I also had problems ordering from the On30Guy, had to settle for Rx60 receivers when I prefer the Rx61 types. I'll be ordering from Micron radio, which seems to have a large inventory. I also like DelTangs, but two things need improvement; a more rugged antenna that doesn't break easily, and more importantly, soldering holes with 0.1"/2.54mm pitch spacing (1.02mm holes) for standard male header pins.

Dan




Country: | Posts: 37 Go to Top of Page

Bernd
Fireman



Posted - 09/28/2018 :  08:54:35 AM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DanTI had the same speed range problem using ESC's for cars. I didn't know at the time using 4 AAA batteries (4.8V), to keep the voltage on my DelTang Rx below 6V, was not enough voltage for the ESC, rated at 9.6V. Maybe this was happening with you.


The receiver voltage is rated at 4.5V to 6V. I was using 6 volts and a 6V motor. Here's what I wrote on the Freerail Forum about the system:

Got the system together and tried a 6 volt motor. As far as I'm concerned this system is a piece of crap. The motor control is almost none existent. The ESC turns the motor on at about 2.8 volts. The motor buzzes and the red LED flashes on ESC. At 4 volts everything smooth's out. Motor is running at almost full speed. Max voltage from the ESC is 5.1 volts. The controlling pot on the Tx is way to sensitive to minuet motor speed adjustments.


quote:
I also had problems ordering from the On30Guy, had to settle for Rx60 receivers when I prefer the Rx61 types. I'll be ordering from Micron radio, which seems to have a large inventory. I also like DelTangs, but two things need improvement; a more rugged antenna that doesn't break easily, and more importantly, soldering holes with 0.1"/2.54mm pitch spacing (1.02mm holes) for standard male header pins.

Dan


I'll have to take a look at Micron. The members of the RMweb Railway Modeling Community rate it as the place to buy DelTang. Agree on a more rugged antenna. Hole spacing for a header pin would be nice also.

Bernd


A PESSIMIST sees a dark tunnel
An OPTIMIST sees light at the end of the tunnel
A REALIST sees a freight train
The LOCOMOTIVE ENGINEER sees three idiots standing on the tracks

Country: USA | Posts: 2606 Go to Top of Page

DanT
New Hire

Posted - 09/28/2018 :  5:29:50 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

It seems 2.8-5.1 volts is just not enough of a range to operate in, plus the controller's insensitivity. My DX5e works well with my DelTang 6 volt Rx43d2 receiver. It's set for low-off vs center-off, so I have full stick motion in forward or reverse. I use a separate channel for reverse.

The link below shows this arrangement installed in an Athearn AMD-103 loco with Hobbytown drive. Power is from 8-AAA NiMH batteries. It had been running at clubs, layouts and shows for the last 5 years. It's being rebuilt and will include two 18500 7.4v, 2,000mAh Li-ion batteries or one 3.7v, 5,200mAh battery, induction charging, a sound decoder, a speaker and LED fiber-optic lighting. And hopefully all in time for the Amherst show.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rUwTYucn6u8

Dan



Country: | Posts: 37 Go to Top of Page

Bernd
Fireman



Posted - 09/29/2018 :  08:24:18 AM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Here's what I used to power a set of three re-motored to 6 volts AHC 2-6-0 steam engines using power from the rails.



I used a Blade Tx. Full range on the throttle. Right stick for throttle and left stick for direction.



Worked very well. I think I had better control than using a transistor throttle to control track voltage.

When is the Amherst show? I'd like nothing more than to meet you in person and see your work on this subject.

Bernd


A PESSIMIST sees a dark tunnel
An OPTIMIST sees light at the end of the tunnel
A REALIST sees a freight train
The LOCOMOTIVE ENGINEER sees three idiots standing on the tracks

Country: USA | Posts: 2606 Go to Top of Page

tloc
Fireman

Premium Member


Posted - 09/29/2018 :  10:03:29 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I gave up for awhile my use of Dead Rail. I fell in love with the ProtoThrottle by ISE that was publicly developed in a thread on the MRH forums. I was using the RailPro throttle and sound modules for Dead Rail and other than the batteries in a second unit (dummy) it was great. But the ProtoThrottle would not interface with the RailPro modules and Tim Ring of RailPro had no interest in helping.

I now run the ESU Cab Control DCC system that does interface with the PT. I sold all battery equipment. Do I miss it, yes and no! It was a no nonsense system easy to use and safe when following the rules of IPo batteries. I never worried about dead frogs or dead spots or dirty spots of track. No as the recharging involved removing the shell from the dummy. Would I go Dead Rail again? Absolutely. I have been following the wireless charging thread and the discussions of Bernd, DanT and BurleyJim and feel that is what I want. 1st though I need and interface between the PT and RailPro modules and the person who was helping me is very sick. So, that project has stalled.

TomO



Country: USA | Posts: 2099 Go to Top of Page

DanT
New Hire

Posted - 09/29/2018 :  12:35:28 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bernd, that's a nice set-up on those steamers. Is that a Mode 1 Tx? I have several of these, but they are Mode 2 with the throttle on the left. Here's the link to the Amherst Show. I was hoping to do a clinic there, but I'll probably just run my BPRC stuff on a couple of layouts. Send me a PM when you can.

http://www.railroadhobbyshow.com/

Tom, I started with r/c because there was so much out there already for planes, cars, trucks, boats, etc. With hundreds of manufacturers feeding the hobby on a global basis, I felt this was the best way to avoid proprietary systems and maximize my options, whatever they would be. After many emails with DavidT at DelTang, I'm happy he decided to tailor some of his receivers for model railroad use. In any case, whatever way you go, glad you appreciate the dead rail concept and the sense of freedom this method offers.

Dan



Edited by - DanT on 09/29/2018 12:38:38 PM

Country: | Posts: 37 Go to Top of Page

Bernd
Fireman



Posted - 09/29/2018 :  2:48:39 PM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by DanT

Bernd, that's a nice set-up on those steamers. Is that a Mode 1 Tx? I have several of these, but they are Mode 2 with the throttle on the left. Here's the link to the Amherst Show. I was hoping to do a clinic there, but I'll probably just run my BPRC stuff on a couple of layouts. Send me a PM when you can.

http://www.railroadhobbyshow.com/

Dan



Just checked. It's a Mode 2, throttle on the left and direction on the right.

Came across the show ad in RMC. PM sent.

Bernd


A PESSIMIST sees a dark tunnel
An OPTIMIST sees light at the end of the tunnel
A REALIST sees a freight train
The LOCOMOTIVE ENGINEER sees three idiots standing on the tracks

Country: USA | Posts: 2606 Go to Top of Page

Bernd
Fireman



Posted - 10/19/2018 :  08:56:10 AM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
A little bump on the subject.

I posted a couple of pictures of the charging boards I got from E-bay on MRH's "What's on your workbench" thread to see if I could create some interest. Neil asked about where I got those boards from. I started a separate thread in hopes of starting a dialog on BPRC. I also pointed out that we have two threads going here on PBRC. Let's see what happens. I'm sure there are going to be some nay-sayer's on MRH.

If anybody is interested in following the thread and see what's said, here's the link (you don't need to be a member to read the forum): https://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/34716

Enjoy

Bernd


A PESSIMIST sees a dark tunnel
An OPTIMIST sees light at the end of the tunnel
A REALIST sees a freight train
The LOCOMOTIVE ENGINEER sees three idiots standing on the tracks

Country: USA | Posts: 2606 Go to Top of Page

neiler
New Hire

Posted - 10/20/2018 :  8:33:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Iím here. Thanks Bernd.

Iíve been doing my own dead rail installs in On30 and garden trains since 2010 (2013 in On30) so have quite a bit of actual bands on experience. After all this time I find myself leaning toward charging tracks either online or in staging. The Stanton battery manager is small enough that a fit isnít difficult and there is no need to remove wipers and connections to the rail.
Wireless charging seems appealing for its simplicity but a section of rail with 5v wouldnít bee too hard to keep clean (he says without ever having tried it). Iím thinking at water stops or engine house tracks. Time to get back into it and fire up the soldering iron!

Neil



Country: USA | Posts: 11 Go to Top of Page
Page: of 7 Topic Next Topic: An Experiment in Wireless Charging  
 New Topic |   Reply to Topic | 
Previous Page | Next Page
Jump To:
Railroad Line Forums © 2000-17 Railroad Line Co. Go To Top Of Page
Steam was generated in 0.5 seconds. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000