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Author Previous Topic: Turnout/Track Compatibility Topic Next Topic: A small expansion to my layout.
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Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 04/23/2006 :  7:03:38 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Wallace,

I will give it a try, using foam brushes or maybe a combination of the two. Anything to make it easier is welcomed.



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

electrolove
Section Hand



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  02:20:48 AM  Show Profile  Visit electrolove's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Joe Fugate's scenery plaster mixture, Swedish edition (step by step with pictures)

http://siskiyou-railfan.net/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.26

I can really recommend his DVD's, they are very nice.

I decided to try Joe Fugate's scenery plaster mixture and this is what I came up with.

I live in Sweden and the hard part for me was to find the right material. After many questions and a lot of thinking I found similar products here in Sweden. Not that easy but I did it. And I want to share it with you all, if it happens to be a Swede listening

Where did I get the material?

Vermiculite 1-2 mm, use 1 mm if you can find it. What a nightmare!

http://www.althea.se

It cost around 1-2 USD for 1 litre (10 SEK/liter) and looks like this.






Patching plaster. I found it at a wellknown store called COOP.

http://www.coop.se

It cost around 11-12 USD for 5 kg (89 SEK för 5 kg, kallas gipsbruk, danogips) and looks like this.






Cement, also found at COOP. It cost around 5-6 USD for 25 kg (45 SEK för 25 kg) and looks like this.






How do you mix it?

First of all, protect your eyes, you don't want plaster or cement powder in your eyes!

Use 4 parts of vermiculite, 3 parts of patching plaster and 1 part cement.



I don't know what this is called in english (scoop?), but I used it, and it worked.



Put the vermiculite, patching plaster and cement in a plastic box and shake well for a minute or two.



Mix it with 3-4 parts of water. You must try this out yourself. All I can say is that you want it thin, but not so thin that it drips. For me 3 and a half part of water was the right mix. If it runs, its too thin. Experiment!






How do you use it?

You can for example use cardboard strips (with 2" masking tape to fill the holes) as the scenery base. I found masking tape at Överskottsbolaget.

http://www.overskottsbolaget.se

Masking tape cost around 3-4 USD for 50 meters. (Maskerings tape 27 SEK för 50 meter) and looks like this.



Use a putty knife (also Överskottsbolaget, cost 1 USD) to spread it out in a 5 mm thick layer. After 2 hours you can make another layer, also 5 mm thick.



After the mix is nearly dry it looks like this.



Closeup inside the dry mix.






Conclusion

I really like the mix so far, even if I have not tried it on my layout yet. It's easy to mix, work with, I'm looking forward to do the rest.

Here is a picture from a little diorama I made to test out the mix. It's spline roadbed, cardboard strips with masking tape and the vermiculite mix.



A BIG thank you to Joe Fugate for great thinking and lots of inspiration.

Must tell you all about the cement. It's so funny Me and my son went to COOP to buy some candy. And there it was, cement! I decided to take it home on my bicycle because I had no car with me. Everything was going great, it took about 45 minutes to walk home. After 20 minutes it started to rain, heavy raining!!! And you all know what happens to cement when it mixes with water, PANIC!!! But I was lucky that day. The paper bag around the cement was thick and it was still cement powder when I got home.



Edited by - electrolove on 05/27/2006 02:22:20 AM

Country: Sweden | Posts: 51 Go to Top of Page

Tabooma County Rwy
Fireman



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  03:00:14 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Wow, great tutorial, Electrolove! And thanks for the link to Joe Fugate's great web site. Lots of good ideas there. I visited Joe's layout on a NMRA tour in 1994, and again in 1997 or 1998. His is of "Mushroom" fame, and it was very interesting to see in person. At that time, he had very little scenery in place. I also remember tight aisles, and it was pretty warm because he lighted the layout with incandescent bulbs - lots of them. He sure packed a lot of layout into his basement space, and the mushroom design really was innovative at that time. Thanks for sharing!


Country: USA | Posts: 4630 Go to Top of Page

electrolove
Section Hand



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  03:30:48 AM  Show Profile  Visit electrolove's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by trussman

The following is a tutorial of how I create desert scenery. It will demostrate how to use goop, with scenic materials. This will establish a base for further scenic work with a newer scenic product called Silor.


This is goop, it is made with equal parts of celluclay, vermiculite, colored latex paint, and white glue. The amount of glue is .75 part.
The color I chose is lighter than the real terrain I am modeling, but I have found it is easier to darken scenery vs. trying to get it lighter.





I have some qesutions about that goop mix. I live in Sweden and I'm trying to understand what celluclay is, can someone please help me with that?

Is the size of the vermiculite importent, should I use vermiculite less then 1mm in size?

When this is dry, what kind of surface do I get, a hard one or a soft, can I drill holes in it?



Edited by - electrolove on 05/27/2006 11:51:44 AM

Country: Sweden | Posts: 51 Go to Top of Page

electrolove
Section Hand



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  03:49:52 AM  Show Profile  Visit electrolove's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Tabooma County Rwy

Wow, great tutorial, Electrolove! And thanks for the link to Joe Fugate's great web site. Lots of good ideas there. I visited Joe's layout on a NMRA tour in 1994, and again in 1997 or 1998. His is of "Mushroom" fame, and it was very interesting to see in person. At that time, he had very little scenery in place. I also remember tight aisles, and it was pretty warm because he lighted the layout with incandescent bulbs - lots of them. He sure packed a lot of layout into his basement space, and the mushroom design really was innovative at that time. Thanks for sharing!



It must have been very nice to see Joe's layout. I live in Sweden so it's hard for me to do it, but I have seen lots of great pictures, and I have all his DVD's. I'm really looking forward to the next DVD on scenery. Joe's a really great guy.



Country: Sweden | Posts: 51 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  10:23:04 AM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Electriclove,

Good question on the Celluclay. It is kind of like Paper mache but ground finer. It can be very dusty but I really beleive you could substitute sculptamold in its place. I found the celluclay at Michaels a hobby\art store. IT is more expensive than sculptamold as well, but I bought it anyway becasue that is what the mix called for. I think I have 5 pounds which will make a lot of goop.

Maybe someone else knows more about what it is made out of, but it appears to be real finely ground paper.



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  10:42:56 AM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Benny,

I am curious about the weight of the mixture. I would think the cement adds weight and that can make things hard to control sometimes.
Normally what I do if using cardboard strips is cover it with a plaster cloth and let it dry to create very light hard shell. Then if needed I can punch down high areas or pry up low area before I put on thin layer of plaster or the goop mix.
I suppose what I am asking is when this mixture dries can you still tweak the final shape or is hard as a rock.




Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

electrolove
Section Hand



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  11:27:07 AM  Show Profile  Visit electrolove's Homepage  Reply with Quote
The cement is there for the color. So you don't end up with a white plaster scenery, so if it cracks you will get gray instead of white. The cement makes it harder quicker. Without cement in the mix it dried in about 50 minutes, with cement in about 10-15 minutes. But I think that also depends on the plaster that is used. Regarding the weight, I have nothing to compare with, but it's pretty light and that's because the vermiculite is light. When the mix is hard I don't think you can do anything about it, it's hard. The nice thing about this mix is that you can pour it over the cardboard strips/maskingtape scenery without building any plaster shell first.

quote:
Originally posted by trussman

Benny,

I am curious about the weight of the mixture. I would think the cement adds weight and that can make things hard to control sometimes.
Normally what I do if using cardboard strips is cover it with a plaster cloth and let it dry to create very light hard shell. Then if needed I can punch down high areas or pry up low area before I put on thin layer of plaster or the goop mix.
I suppose what I am asking is when this mixture dries can you still tweak the final shape or is hard as a rock.






Edited by - electrolove on 05/27/2006 11:59:04 AM

Country: Sweden | Posts: 51 Go to Top of Page

electrolove
Section Hand



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  11:37:28 AM  Show Profile  Visit electrolove's Homepage  Reply with Quote
If it's like paper mache, does that mean that I can use fine bits of newspaper + wallpaper glue instead of the celluclay? The reason I ask is because it seems that I get lots of glue from a little package of wallpaper glue and the newspaper is free.

quote:
Originally posted by trussman

Electriclove,

Good question on the Celluclay. It is kind of like Paper mache but ground finer. It can be very dusty but I really beleive you could substitute sculptamold in its place. I found the celluclay at Michaels a hobby\art store. IT is more expensive than sculptamold as well, but I bought it anyway becasue that is what the mix called for. I think I have 5 pounds which will make a lot of goop.

Maybe someone else knows more about what it is made out of, but it appears to be real finely ground paper.





Edited by - electrolove on 05/27/2006 11:53:39 AM

Country: Sweden | Posts: 51 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  12:36:37 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Benny,


I would sure give it a try, free works for me.

The tutorial result looks good and I am a believer in trying and using whatever works. Keep posting your progress photos.

Are you going to fill up your modeling space with a layout or will it have other use's?




Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

electrolove
Section Hand



Posted - 05/27/2006 :  12:42:39 PM  Show Profile  Visit electrolove's Homepage  Reply with Quote
It will only be a layout there, nothing else. But I'm not sure yet how to build my layout. I'm not 100% satisfied with my trackplan, or the lack of it So please suggest whatever you think is good, if you have the time.

I think it will take a couple of weeks before I start building the benchwork.

quote:
Originally posted by trussman

Benny,


I would sure give it a try, free works for me.

The tutorial result looks good and I am a believer in trying and using whatever works. Keep posting your progress photos.

Are you going to fill up your modeling space with a layout or will it have other use's?






Country: Sweden | Posts: 51 Go to Top of Page

Dutchman
Administrator

Premium Member


Posted - 06/02/2006 :  03:06:35 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Note: Tim (trussman) originally began posting his latest scenery work in his Overland Green River Basin RR – Construction thread, but asked that I move it here to the scenery thread.

Well I couldn't stand it any longer, I decided to work on scenery again. This time it will be a much larger project and it will take some time to finish. I thought I would show the steps I go through to make a large chunk of scenery that contains a great deal of rock work at a bench.

First photo is a picture of a picture. This is the area I am modeling and this particular kind of rock work strata I have not modeled before. So it will be a learning curve as I go along.




Next 3 photos show the styrofoam stacked up from different angles. I am using 2" styrofoam that is glued together using a caulking mastic. The base layer is the only permanent one and then the balance of all other layers rest on top of this. This allows me to remove the whole mountain in one section and work on carving and the plaster work elsewhere. (much much easier).





There are 3 more layers yet to be added to the top, so it should give that towering look I am looking for.





This last photo is a shot under the bridge, and if you look close you can see where I ground out the river bed. The vertical distance between the water and the bottom of the bridge is rather close in reality and I plan on modeling it like this. I hope it doesn't look to odd.



That is it for now as I need to wait for the glue to dry. Let me know if you have any questions and I will try to answer them if I can.

Tim


Bruce

Country: USA | Posts: 31813 Go to Top of Page

Dutchman
Administrator

Premium Member


Posted - 06/02/2006 :  03:09:31 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Note: Here is Tim's second scenery post. He will pick it up from here.

I made some progress tonight; the first photo shows what the area looks like with the lift out section removed. You can see I made a base in this case for the lift out to set on.



This shows the lift out section removed and up in the shop. Notice all the square edges on the styrofoam. I will start smoothing them out in the next photo.



I use whatever is the fastest to remove foam. I have even used a chain saw to do some heavy duty carving. However, it does fill the shop with fumes quickly, so if you try it, make sure you do it in an open area. In this case I am using a paint stripper wheel in a drill. It really can take off the foam, but as you can see it’s messy.



This photo shows the lift out section with the edges smoothed out.



In the last photo it shows I am beginning to grind in some rock structure shapes. There is more grinding to do and I will continue on that tomorrow. Plus I need to add two more layers, now that I figured out how to remove it and re-install it. Yes I have done it wrong before, and not been able to install it.



Tim


Bruce

Edited by - Dutchman on 06/02/2006 03:16:42 AM

Country: USA | Posts: 31813 Go to Top of Page

Cigarguy
Fireman



Posted - 06/02/2006 :  06:29:41 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Tim - I can see those mountains are already taking shape. I have used a variety of tools to shave the foam as well - the worst part of this entire process is the clean up!

Mike
D&B Lumber Co.
"The Best Wood You Ever Saw!"

Country: USA | Posts: 3895 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 06/02/2006 :  08:43:52 AM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks Bruce for moviing the post over.


Mike, You are RIGHT on the mess, but I have to say its prety fast and you can carve and visualize at the same time. I enjoy working with styrofoam but I also work with most other methods. It just depends on the area to be covered with scenery. One thing for certain, I have not found anything that matches a styrofoam base when it comes to installing signs, trees, and telephone poles.

I need to figure out what to use all those styrofoam crumblies for.

BTW Mike...I haven't seen a post on your layout for awhile....whats up? Still in semi burnout mode?



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page
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