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Author Previous Topic: HTRR - Chapter 2 Topic Next Topic: Northeast Kingdom Railroad
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milocomarty
Fireman



Posted - 09/17/2011 :  6:15:20 PM  Show Profile  Visit milocomarty's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Great trees Jos, need some advice here, did some like your sequoias but still got this I'm to dense on the fibers...

I know it's a lot of try and error but a bit of advice here downgrades the error thing...
thanks in advance...

Btw Frederic did you prime it, helps a lot in sticking the glue sawdust to the wire..


http://martinwelberg.wordpress.com/
http://cardiganbaycoastalrailroad.wordpress.com/

Country: Netherlands | Posts: 6622 Go to Top of Page

Frederic Testard
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 09/17/2011 :  6:18:53 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
No, Martin, I forgot to prime the armature... Ooops.


Country: France | Posts: 17579 Go to Top of Page

milocomarty
Fireman



Posted - 09/17/2011 :  6:39:45 PM  Show Profile  Visit milocomarty's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Frederic Testard

No, Martin, I forgot to prime the armature... Ooops.



No problem had it with the first ones to, switched to the fast drying woodglue for the sawdust bark...


http://martinwelberg.wordpress.com/
http://cardiganbaycoastalrailroad.wordpress.com/

Country: Netherlands | Posts: 6622 Go to Top of Page

scotchpine
Engine Wiper

Posted - 09/17/2011 :  6:47:55 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello Frederic and Martin.

yes Martin you're right: you have to primer first and than add/paint the white glue( just a litlle bit deluted with some drops of water!)on the frame.
Here a picture of the sequoia under construction;

I still had to remove the loose and to much fibers .....by using tweezers and shaping the fibers with a sharp pair of siscors...
I also think, Martin, that you don't have enough branches on that trunk....
Also try to cut the fibers in lenhts of 1-2 cm and than glue them on the branches with some sprayglue....the tree I see on your picture looks like it is overdone with fibers....
Here a picture after "cleaning up"the loose fibers and adding some 6 mm grassfibers over the decotwisterfibers that were left after my "cleaning up" I also painted( sprayed) them in a brown/dark color.




and added some fine turf from WS or any other kind of needles/leaves.....

Jos



Country: Netherlands | Posts: 332 Go to Top of Page

Frederic Testard
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 09/18/2011 :  07:59:18 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Jos, am I wrong if I say that the right tree (with no fibers or foliage) is a wooden trunk with mainly untwisted florist wire?


Country: France | Posts: 17579 Go to Top of Page

scotchpine
Engine Wiper

Posted - 09/18/2011 :  10:18:48 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Frederic, you're 1/2 right...
The trunk of this tree is made of balsa and 1/2 way it is made out of a frame of floristic wires made like the picture beneeth:

May be a closer look at one of my first posts( page 4) overhere:Posted - 09/18/2008 : 5:38:24 PM, specialy the first 2 pictures. I think you can use floristic wires with a diam. 0,7 mm as shown in the second picture.
I made a small hole in the top of (balsa)trunk and put the "groundpin" in it...I masked the transition with some layers of fine sawdust( glued with whiteglue)

Of course you can add easily some more branches on/in the balsa trunk so the trunk could be almost invisable! ;-) or "shorter.....

Jos



Edited by - scotchpine on 09/18/2011 10:29:35 AM

Country: Netherlands | Posts: 332 Go to Top of Page

Frederic Testard
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 09/18/2011 :  10:42:06 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the explanation. I see it. Why not using a complete balsa trunk?


Country: France | Posts: 17579 Go to Top of Page

scotchpine
Engine Wiper

Posted - 09/18/2011 :  10:59:52 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I do want as many as possible branches on the top...also , if I used all the way a balsa trunk 'till the top it should only 0,6 mm in diam...that is to thin...only pointing at it will break the top of the balsatrunk!
Also drilling small holes for the floristic wires is a pain when that thin!
Another , very important reason, is that this tree will grow somewhere else on a layout...so I do not know what will happen with it and how the next owner will treat this kind of trees???.....so I want it as strong as it can be....
btw: any results ( to be shown overhere)about the frame/trunk of your tree so far???
Jos



Country: Netherlands | Posts: 332 Go to Top of Page

Frederic Testard
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 09/18/2011 :  11:56:39 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here is a first pic. The lack of primer plus the use of a too coarse sawdust made me remove it and start again. Currently it's been primed and the primer is drying. I shot the unprimed frame.






Country: France | Posts: 17579 Go to Top of Page

Frederic Testard
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 09/18/2011 :  1:48:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The second armature done this afternoon.






Country: France | Posts: 17579 Go to Top of Page

milocomarty
Fireman



Posted - 09/18/2011 :  2:01:46 PM  Show Profile  Visit milocomarty's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Thanks Jos, will give it a try with more branches...tough job tho this tree building..

http://martinwelberg.wordpress.com/
http://cardiganbaycoastalrailroad.wordpress.com/

Country: Netherlands | Posts: 6622 Go to Top of Page

scotchpine
Engine Wiper

Posted - 09/18/2011 :  2:07:04 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
WHOW Frederic...that's looks like a lot of twisting/work!
Why not the "easy"way:
I use, as you mentioned already, a "main corewire"...around that wire I built op the branches.....by making loops...
Watch the pictures carefuly and I hope it will be
claer how I "twist"the wires to become a nice straight trunk + branchesframe
first one is the base of the treeframe= trunk with "dead"branches



next one is the top:

As you can see I gently tore the wires apart some mm...to show how many loops you can make out of one wire each = 40 cm long.
When glueing the frame with cheap "superglue" I slide the twisted wires firmly + carefuly against each other.
So when frame is ready you've got a 2 dimensional frametree.

I bend the first/highest "branch" straight up as the topbranch...and cut away the corewire wich is to thick comparing with the branchwires I use...( of course this is not that important, just small details...

When superglue is dry ( at least an hour!) you can bend the wires in shape...
The same but now in N scale:4-6 inches



Jos




Edited by - scotchpine on 09/18/2011 2:26:25 PM

Country: Netherlands | Posts: 332 Go to Top of Page

Frederic Testard
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 09/18/2011 :  4:37:40 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the additionnal (I know, already published...) hints, Jos.

Maybe I misinterpreded the hint "two wires" in the bottom part of this image :



Also I shall have to wait a little for the sawdust since even the most finely ground I have is still a bit coarse compared to what your pics show. I suppose I'll have to try to locate a thinner sieve...



Country: France | Posts: 17579 Go to Top of Page

scotchpine
Engine Wiper

Posted - 09/19/2011 :  4:38:58 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes Frederic, I know ...I had to write: 2 seperate wires...twisted on/over the core wire.( lucky me my english improved just a little bit!)
The reason why is that I want a straight slender trunk just the ones like in a real dense forrest were many trees grow together in competition to get as much light as possible...
The sawdust is realy like fine dust!( wearing a dustmask!!!)
May be using very fine clean dryed clay from outside? Building up layer after layer, specialy for the small slender trunk type of trees.

Jos



Country: Netherlands | Posts: 332 Go to Top of Page

Frederic Testard
Engineer

Premium Member


Posted - 09/19/2011 :  6:30:53 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the hints, Jos. I'll follow them for the next trees, and will try to improve my decorating technique on these two first armatures. And since I work in a rather large scale (I mean, compared to N), I'll probably be able to justify a less slender trunk.
Do you think wooden picks used for cooking pieces of meat on the BBQ would make a good core for the trunk or would the model be too fragile this way?



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