Railroad Line Forums - Overland Green River Basin RR.- construction
Railroad Line Forums
Username:
Password:
Save Password


Register
Forgot Password?
  Home   Forums   Events Calendar   Sponsors   Support the RRLine   Guestbook   FAQ     Register
Active Topics | Active Polls | Resources | Members | Online Users | Live Chat | Avatar Legend | Search | Statistics
Photo Album | File Lister | File Library
[ Active Members: 1 | Anonymous Members: 0 | Guests: 71 ]  [ Total: 72 ]  [ Newest Member: johnnycee6 ]
 All Forums
 Model Railroad Forums
 Model Railroad Construction
 Overland Green River Basin RR.- construction
Previous Page | Next Page
 New Topic |   New Poll New Poll |   Reply to Topic | 
Author Previous Topic: Pot Topper: How I use it in scenery construction Topic Next Topic: Electrical Requirements
Page: of 101

MikeC
Administrator

Premium Member


Posted - 11/20/2006 :  4:56:54 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by trussman

Mike C,

I bought some Future wax the other day for another project, but I am curious. Do you use it to make ripples on the water? I thought gloss medium was stiff enough to do that but Future wax is?
The water look I am after is a moving river. It has very if any white water, the surface would not be perfectly flat. How is the best way to do this, in your opinion?



Tim, Future is too "watery" (thin) to make ripples, even when it's nearly dry. I use it only as a final top coat or to repair scratches. Acrylic gloss medium (either Liquitex or Mod Podge) is ideal to make the ripples. Then, if I'm not happy with the glossy sheen after it's dried, I overcoat it with the Future.

To get the look you're wanting isn't too difficult, but you might want to practice on some painted scrap first. I use a soft, round brush and create small (radius) "swirls" with a moderate brush load of gloss medium. I work my way back and forth across the "water" until the length is covered with swirls. One coat usually is not enough to get the right look for me. So after the first coat is dry, I repeat the swirls with a second coat. I don't attempt to keep the second coat aligned with the first but shoot for some variety in the texture instead. When it's completely dry, there should be enough ripple or visual "movement" to the water that it looks convincing. If not, then I apply a third coat. I've also found that photos are a good way to verify the look is what I want. For better or worse, the camera never lies.

I think you've already seen these, but take a look at the surface of the "water." There's movement, but it's not rapid enough to cause much - if any - white water or strong rapids. It took 3 applications of Mod Podge before I was happy with it.










Country: USA | Posts: 21584 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 11/20/2006 :  6:44:47 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks Mike,
When looking at the third picture I can see the texture to the water clearly. I think what I will do is paint something tonight with the bottom color I am using and then do the test/learning technique as you described.
I don't want to be a pest, but I have all kind of brushes that very in size and shape. You mentioned round, but what size brush?

My guess is something about 1/4" across. I think I understand the brush technique in making small radius swirls by pressing down and slightly twisty the brush then lift at the end of the stroke. Sound right?

I did the pour as soon as I got home and I mixed two batches, mixture one had some color and mixture 2 with 3 times the color. Mixture 1 I poured next to the bank and then followes with the 2nd one in the middle. I am happy to report the mixing and blending worked very well. Its still is not as dark as I wanted but at least I know it works and it is easy to blend. Surprised myself.
I am not sure if I want to do a 3rd pour or not, but if I do I will use the same technique.



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 11/20/2006 :  6:49:36 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Mike,
One more question, I have heard of modelers doing as many as 5-10 pours of Envirotex. How many did you do on your stream and is there a norm for this. Mine are pretty thick, but I am wondering how thick the water should be when finished for an application like mine.


BTW ..your stream looks terrific, the colors from light to dark are very realistic. The use of sticks etc make it very convincing.



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

MikeC
Administrator

Premium Member


Posted - 11/20/2006 :  8:06:22 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by trussman


... I have all kind of brushes that very in size and shape. You mentioned round, but what size brush?

My guess is something about 1/4" across. I think I understand the brush technique in making small radius swirls by pressing down and slightly twisty the brush then lift at the end of the stroke. Sound right?




Tim, I think the brush I used was a Loew-Cornell #8 Round ("Comfort" contoured handle ) It's roughly 1/4" at the ferrule although it tapers to a point at the end. To make the swirls, I don't twist the brush. I hold it between my fingers, as I would a pencil, and make the swirls by slighly moving my hand and wrist. I just work in spirals back and forth across the stream.

quote:
One more question, I have heard of modelers doing as many as 5-10 pours of Envirotex. How many did you do on your stream and is there a norm for this. Mine are pretty thick, but I am wondering how thick the water should be when finished for an application like mine.


I didn't use Envirotex for this one, Tim. It's just Mod Podge right over the painted creek bed. On other projects, I don't remember ever pouring more than 3 layers. For Millers Creek on my CM&S layout, I used only 2 pours of Envirotex. I don't think there's really a norm for this. It pretty much comes down to what looks right, I think.




Country: USA | Posts: 21584 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 11/20/2006 :  8:56:11 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks Mike, I am not sure I have the comfort control handle thing, but I can see I need to wise up in my future purchases.

From what I can tell so far, this water thing is all about getting the right color and the opacity correct. I have decided there will be another pour, as the color is just not right yet. I will just keep pouring till its what I want or the banks are flooded!

I wonder once the envirotex dries will the color also get darker, like paint on a wall. I guess I will have to wait to see.



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

Mike Hamer
Engineer



Posted - 11/20/2006 :  8:57:10 PM  Show Profile  Visit Mike Hamer's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Mike, yours is the most realistic stream bed I've ever seen modelled! Incredibly realistic. Tim, glad to see you taking on the water challenge and I look forward to seeing the results! Keep up the great work.

Mike Hamer
Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
http://www.bostonandmaine.blogspot.ca
http://www.craftsmanstructures.blogspot.ca
http://modelrailroadsivisit.blogspot.ca

Country: | Posts: 11492 Go to Top of Page

C Laskey
Crew Chief



Posted - 11/20/2006 :  10:05:27 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Tim,

I have been following this thread for quite a while now and your backdrops and your scenery is outstanding. As far as water goes, I use Envirotex for all my water. If you go to the Craftman's Corner on page 31 or 32 and look under dioramas you will see the water at Threadwell Textile. The ripples were made by poking it with a screwdriver after 12 hours. It will give you a moving water effect. I hope this is of some help.

Carl



Country: USA | Posts: 887 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 11/20/2006 :  10:19:38 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
I am hoping the water color gets darker as it dries. The bluish green is pretty close to the real photos, but needs to be darker overall. The enviortex is wet in these photos. Amazing how reflective it is as you can see the mountains and trees in the photos.










I thought some of you might be interested in this Silfor product, its the cactus looking thing in the middle of the picture. Its called horsetail foilage sillfor and it comes in several colors. It could past as a neat bush in my opinion. Its the first time I used it.



I started working on the road tonight and I painted the fron edge an earth color. Maybe I should of left it the fascia color. hmmm



Since I can' work without making dust, I decided to play some checkers. The water probaly would not look to good with a bunch of dust stuck to it.




Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

Cigarguy
Fireman



Posted - 11/21/2006 :  06:53:09 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Tim,
I am continually amazed by your level of expertise. You are a true artist in every sense of the word. I was showing some photos of your scenery to some friends, and they thought I was showing them prototype photos! Continued kudos to you - your modeling truly motivates me to try harder and gives me a high benchmark to shoot for. I'm sure I'm not alone in these sentiments.



Mike
D&B Lumber Co.
"The Best Wood You Ever Saw!"

Country: USA | Posts: 3895 Go to Top of Page

Dutchman
Administrator

Premium Member


Posted - 11/21/2006 :  07:47:20 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Cigarguy

Continued kudos to you - your modeling truly motivates me to try harder and gives me a high benchmark to shoot for. I'm sure I'm not alone in these sentiments.



Mike, I'm with you on this one. Tim, keep the progress photos coming.


Bruce

Country: USA | Posts: 31797 Go to Top of Page

Tabooma County Rwy
Fireman



Posted - 11/21/2006 :  09:58:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Mike (Cigarguy), you said it all...Tim is definitely way ahead of most of us. Incredible modeling, Tim. The river looks very good to me, as does the road. And I like the Silfor bush - gotta place an order with Scenic Express soon!


Country: USA | Posts: 4630 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 11/21/2006 :  3:16:41 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Thank you all for taking the time to comment and giving me input. It is very much appreciated. When it comes to scenery, I enjoy creating the scenes, but when it comes to talent, I am a trial and error type modeler. I don't get as much done as would like, because of this trial and error mentallity I have.
That is why I enjoy this forum so much, its full of great modelers that are willing to share and help motivate others to improve there own modeling. I know that is the case with me. By having your input and comments it only makes me strive to get better and to keep on going.

I have to say, that while winter is fast approaching, my excitment level about model railroading is as high as its been for quite a while. Much of the credit is due to the encouragment of this forum.
Thanks to all......and stay tuned



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

MikeC
Administrator

Premium Member


Posted - 11/21/2006 :  6:05:54 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by trussman

Thanks Mike, I am not sure I have the comfort control handle thing



Comfort handle? But of course....



Tim, these are two of the brushes I use quite a bit when doing scenery work (such as swirling Mod Podge or pushing dirt and pebbles into place). They're relatively inexpensive, which is good enough for scenery work, and they have nice sized handles that are also contoured for an easy grip. I get mine at Michaels.




Country: USA | Posts: 21584 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 11/21/2006 :  6:18:38 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Mike,

Those are the cleanest brushes I have ever seen. I am heading out to Michaels over the weekend, I will check them out. I am learning that comfort is what its all about.

Plus I have a coupon for Michaels, and I need to use it.
Thanks for the picture it really helps.



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page

Tim Kerkhoff
Fireman



Posted - 11/21/2006 :  11:20:55 PM  Show Profile  Send Tim Kerkhoff a Yahoo! Message  Reply with Quote
Here we go with the third pour, I keep learning and I am pretty happy with this one. I mixed two batches as before, one darker than the other and you can visibly see how the blending worked. What do you think?












I decided to add the bridges and see what it looks like. I might need to tone down the weathering on the bridges, but its close.









Somebody needs to tell me how to take a photo of a reflective surface and not get everything showing. Is that possible?



Country: USA | Posts: 5879 Go to Top of Page
Page: of 101 Previous Topic: Pot Topper: How I use it in scenery construction Topic Next Topic: Electrical Requirements  
 New Topic |   New Poll New Poll |   Reply to Topic | 
Previous Page | Next Page
Jump To:
Railroad Line Forums © 2000-19 Railroad Line Co. Go To Top Of Page
Steam was generated in 0.56 seconds. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000